Rep. Jeannie Darneille Saves: Passing The Mental Health Tax in Tacoma
by NineInchNachos on 5/29/2012 @ 2:01am
|Hey look she's running for Senate! |
by debivans on 5/29/2012 @ 5:00am
|I suspect the building I live in and a few more in my neighborhood are some of these private sector contractors. OK, I'm going to go listen to the voices now. Bye.|
by fredo on 5/29/2012 @ 5:02am
Hey look, you misspelled her name!
by CaptainBritton on 5/29/2012 @ 6:44am
|EDITOR! Quick-Photo-Shop Fix-It!
by jenyum on 5/29/2012 @ 8:10am
by NineInchNachos on 5/29/2012 @ 8:13am
by NineInchNachos on 5/29/2012 @ 8:14am
by NineInchNachos on 5/29/2012 @ 8:39am
|thanks for the YOUTUBE link TacomaMama! |
will fix the Typo tonight, sorry for the inconvenience folks!
by InvaderPet on 5/29/2012 @ 9:39am
|That "Safe Place" had better not be my house.|
by cisserosmiley on 5/29/2012 @ 10:13am
|But WE have a world class golf course, why do you criticize? www.youtube.com/watch?v=19-QymNb5ts&feat...
by The Jinxmedic on 5/29/2012 @ 10:16am
by NineInchNachos on 5/29/2012 @ 10:41am
|yes the mentally ill with no place to go could be the caddies ! or grounds crew..|
by cisserosmiley on 5/29/2012 @ 11:15am
|WE should mandate a certain number of dd employees at OUR PUBLIC golf course. What about that Pat McCarthy?|
by NineInchNachos on 5/29/2012 @ 11:21am
|the homeless love golf too!|
by NineInchNachos on 5/29/2012 @ 12:06pm
|WELCOME TO THE FUTURE! www.seattleweekly.com/2012-05-23/news/op...|
"After the state legislature slashed millions of dollars in funding for mental-health services, the Tacoma region opted to become the first area in the state to put their local mental-health operations in the hands of private business. OptumHealth, typically shortened to just Optum, was chosen in 2009 to coordinate the county's crisis and psychiatric services. As incentive to do the job well, Optum is allowed to keep for administration and profit 10 percent of the $54 million in state funds dispersed annually to Pierce County."
by NineInchNachos on 5/29/2012 @ 12:24pm
|"Both suicides and suicide attempts have steadily increased countywide since Optum took over in 2009. The number of mentally ill people booked into the Pierce County jail in downtown Tacoma has risen to the point that one official says it has become "a de facto psychiatric facility."
(see the Traveller)
by NineInchNachos on 5/29/2012 @ 1:07pm
|That seattle weekly article is huge. Hope everyone reads it.|
by Maria on 5/29/2012 @ 7:43pm
|Eight pages / 20 minutes -- wow, RR, that's an amazing and sad article. There were a few good changes that were made, and it's always great to save money and have more efficient social services. But not if the suicide rate goes up and if mentally ill folks are not getting the help they need. Funneling them through the courts and prison system versus getting them proper help is also not wise spending.|
Hope Pierce County can work with Optum (the private company providing services) to change some of these problems. Private contracting can work, but sounds like there needs to be some extra oversight, benchmarks and accountability in place.
by NineInchNachos on 5/29/2012 @ 9:05pm
|POUND THAT REFRESH! typo fixed with BONUS content infusion|
by NineInchNachos on 5/30/2012 @ 9:26am
|she is on #FB ! |
by JesseHillFan on 5/30/2012 @ 2:10pm
|Honestly the best looking girl I ever met in my entire life was completely insane.Insane but insanely beautiful.|
by fredo on 5/30/2012 @ 3:54pm
|Darnielle isn't saving poor people. She just introduced a new way for elected officials to slam the poorest among us with a new regressive tax. |
Her meddling will probably save some government workers jobs so I guess there will be a few greatful people out there.
by NineInchNachos on 5/30/2012 @ 4:03pm
|You are wrong Fredo. Darnielle and Tacoma have probably saved lives and prevented untold Gabby Giffords style shootings as well. Guns don't kill people, but unstable psychotic patients off their meds might.|
by cisserosmiley on 5/30/2012 @ 4:20pm
|We probably should take better care of prople with mental health challenges.|
by NineInchNachos on 5/30/2012 @ 4:22pm
|what are civilizations for?|
by The Jinxmedic on 5/30/2012 @ 4:40pm
by fredo on 5/30/2012 @ 5:04pm
| " Darnielle and Tacoma have probably saved lives and prevented untold Gabby Giffords style shootings as well." |
So when poor people are taxed out of their homes to pay for these mental health services and become depressed they will then have some place to go and get mental health treatments? That makes zero sense.
Also, what about the non-gabby giffords killings that go on aroud Tacoma all the time. Didn't some mother just kill her 3 year old son and some other hilltop resident stabbed his buddy and cut off all his arms and legs? Tell us how the Darnielle style mental health taxes helped to prevent those killings.
by cisserosmiley on 5/30/2012 @ 5:42pm
|A person without mental health challenges will be able to endure the injustice of higher taxes.|
by fredo on 5/30/2012 @ 6:12pm
|People with no obvious mental health challenges become depressed all the time. The cause of this depression is frequently mounting personal economic issues. But of course the liberals don't want to limit people becoming mental health patients they want to increase the number. Keep people tethered to some type of program as long as possible, old chap. |
More depressed voters means more votes for people pretending to be concerned about depressed voters.
by Maria on 5/30/2012 @ 6:58pm
|We're going to take care of the mentally ill, one way or another. Either wage-earners taking time off work to care for family members, the county/city jail wasting very expensive space and staff for people who need a different type of care, homeless shelters filling up with people unable to care for themselves, emergency rooms receiving patients that could have been handled differently, and/or violent episodes by psychotic or delusional folks, harming others or themselves.|
Untreated clients with mental health illnesses are 4-6 times more likely to be incarcerated which increase expenses in the state’s justice system.
It's kinda like the thing with healthcare. Those who can't afford health insurance still get healthcare, but in the most expensive way possible (i.e., through the emergency rooms, when they're extremely sick and costs are exponentially higher for things that could have been addressed at the beginning stages). There's even a term for it: spillover. When people can't get mental health care, they spill over into the medical and justice system.
However--I get your point, Fredo, that we can't let government grow and grow to the point where everything is a handout and taxes are are ridiculous. But if we can spend $1 to save spending $10-$100, that sounds like good fiscal management. I'm sure the city and county prosecutors would rather the police force and court system focus on dealing with criminal offenders and making our region safer, rather than taking care of the mentally ill.
This seems to be a reasonable and very small tax increase. If combined with other community services (the alcohol impact area, group homes, early detection of disorders and substance abuse treatment), studies have shown that mental health initiatives can save costs and get people help.
We all want a more vibrant and healthy neighborhoods. This amount of spending isn't much, but small steps of progress on multiple levels will lead to a safer and more liveable community. There isn't a magic want to make cities wonderful...but adequate mental health services is a part of being a decent, compassionate and responsible public entity.
by fredo on 5/30/2012 @ 7:36pm
I think what you are saying is that those people living along the financial margins for whom a small tax increase is a major problem (and may end up with depression themselves) are just collateral damage in the war on mental health problems.
by NineInchNachos on 5/30/2012 @ 7:39pm
|it's the christian thing to do god damn it! Don't like paying the tiny tax, move to texas.|
by Maria on 5/30/2012 @ 7:50pm
|Fredo, if they're living on the fringes, at the poverty level of $11,170 for an individual, even if they spend their entire income on items that would be taxed, it would only be $11.17. Hardly a deal breaker for anyone, especially since it's over 12 months, i.e., $1 a month.|
If it were a frivolous tax, let's say for tropical rain gardens with mango trees on Pacific Avenue, then we'd best veto this. But to spend ten cents to save up to a dollar or more (on jail, ER, juvenile detention, etc.) is a good investment!!
I hope some of the money will go to substance abuse treatment. That's probably the biggest factor in violent crime and incarceration by the way.
by fredo on 5/30/2012 @ 8:11pm
|Every minor tax increase is only a small increase...when considered by itself.|
Unfortunately, we have taxing districts all over the place which keep adding minor tax increases on everybody and they are all cumlative. We just had a .1% sales tax increase to support 911. And Pierce Transit is coming with a sales tax increase this fall and the city council is coming with a .50/1,000 property tax increase in the fall. The effect of ALL these increases will be a "deal breaker" for some people. Just because a sales tax increase is meant to address mental health issues doesn't mean that it won't inadvertantly increase mental health issues.
by NineInchNachos on 5/30/2012 @ 8:30pm
|blah blah blah be a patriot and pay your taxes Mr. house in the Philippines|
by cisserosmiley on 5/30/2012 @ 8:44pm
|I'm not much for new taxes, but this one is smart for everyone Fredo. Most people who pee on busses need MH services. Think of how much more use we could get out of pierce transit if the pee smell was gone.|
by NineInchNachos on 5/30/2012 @ 8:46pm
|yes forget the mad shooting rampages... no pee smell should be worth it alone!!!|
by fredo on 5/31/2012 @ 7:47am
Don't get your hopes too high. After the tax takes effect there will still be crazy murders, overcrowded emergency rooms, and pee on the buses. And the people who were poor before will be just a litttle poorer afterwards.
by NineInchNachos on 5/31/2012 @ 7:57am
|hey that Seattle cafe shooter who killed 5 people before turning gun on himself?... NPR said today he has a history of mental illness. |
I wonder if he was on the OPTUM healthcare plan?
by cisserosmiley on 5/31/2012 @ 7:58am
|There us some truth there Fredo. Studies reflect that MH diagnosis will rise to slightly above treatment capacity, regardless of how high or low capacity is. But when treatment levels drop below parity with surrounding areas it puts a strain on our services often resulting in ot pay, law suits, and poor performance. Tacoma is simply adjusting upward to the rest of the surrounding areas because low balling MH services did in fact coincide with more MH cases going untreated.|
by fredo on 5/31/2012 @ 11:20am
|Maria, you say that when there are insufficient mental health services that the problem spills over into police/incarceration/ and emergency rooms. And that's a more expensive way to treat them, according to your posting.|
Well, if that's true then why don't we take the extra money we're using to treat them in police stations, prisons, and emergency rooms and use that money INSTEAD to pay for their mental health services?
I don't see how we're SAVING funds by generating MORE funds.
by Maria on 5/31/2012 @ 4:13pm
|Good questions. Here are my answers:|
While we're taking "extra" funds from the jails and hospitals, we should go ahead and transfer money from the parking fund and from the city utilities!
Creative accounting is not a long-term fix for financial or social problems. If mental health services are underfunded, and if it would best serve our community to provide some services, they must be allocated and budgeted properly, not left to balloon as a parasite tick on the abdomen of the budgets for city/county jails or hospital emergency rooms. I can't see how it would add to city fiscal responsibility to intermingle funds. How it saves funds is very simple.
Does it make sense to send your kid to school on a bike, or pay for a limo? Is it necessary to have a limo take him the four blocks to school? Even if you had to work a few extra hours to afford that bike...you're already losing hundreds every day by charging the limo on your credit card or using your grocery money to pay the chauffeur. You save money by not wasting it on unnecessary expertise (a bike would work just as well as a limo for the purpose needed). The old folks used to call that "penny-wise but pound-foolish.
"In the same way, if mental health care is provided through community-based services, the cost is lower than when we use super-expensive public entities like jails or ER rooms.
Community-based mental health care--$12 per day
Homeless shelter--$22 per day
Supportive housing for mentally-ill--$24 per day
Jail cell, no treatment--$45 per day
Prison--$86 per day
Jail cell with mental health treatment--$140 per day
Juvenile detention hall--$230 per day
Psychiatric hospital--$280 per day
Short-term hospitalization via ER--$1600 per day
The danger is that social service spending outpaces economic growth, and we enter into a fiscal crisis like Greece or Italy, lovely places where the government outspends revenue.
So I'm not saying overspend or overtax. Those are real dangers, I think. The economy is pretty bad right now and we can't afford to fully fund any social services, arts, road repairs, etc. to the degree we may want.
Yes, governments tend to expand and expand, becoming inefficient and collapsing. But isn't there a middle ground between medieval FEUDALISM where you had the haves and have-nots and zero safety nets, and COMMUNISM where the state dictates everything and no one has incentive to succeed and everything is lousy? Can't there be a progressive democracy that's compassionate and conservative?
Don't tell me I can own a 5 inch piece of metal and glass that receives photos from Mars, yet we can't improve in other areas!! That's fatalism, almost as bad as apathy.
by fredo on 5/31/2012 @ 4:21pm
|I think what you are saying is that|
If mental health services are provided in a context OTHER than the mental health arena then the taxpayers pay MORE.
But then you seem to contradict this philosophy by saying if we have mental health funding through a mental health tax that we will not experience any savings.
If we are going to save money in ER, police and incarceration then where is that Savings going to go? Either there ARE savings or there AREN'T savings. You can't have it both ways.
by Maria on 5/31/2012 @ 5:16pm
|The savings goes to pay for jail time for criminals and health care for the sick...rather than being spent on locking up psychotic people or diverted to medical care for the mentally ill. |
It doesn't get "saved" per se. When wasteful spending is reformed, there is not some transfer of the former amount wasted to another account. Otherwise that would be a tax on efficiency.
That's all I have to say about this. It's not that difficult to understand the difference in costs when one is spending $12 or $120 for similar services, and how that affects budgets for a municipality.
by fredo on 5/31/2012 @ 5:45pm
|We are going to spend $12 for something we used to spend $120 for. |
But there are no savings.
"It's not that difficult to understand"
by NineInchNachos on 6/5/2012 @ 3:21pm
|need to do another update. Tim Farrell is the only pierce county council member to support our public mental healthcare system.|
by amsierra on 6/7/2012 @ 1:21am
|The Seattle Weekly did a great job addressing this very complicated issue. Taxes are only one part of the solution and an important part. The control of these services needs to be returned to the local level. Optum is more than a contractor. They are a for profit organization and aim to take over MH services everywhere because that's what corporations do, the grow in order to make money. They also use their profits to elect their candidates and influence policy. The accountability becomes hard to enforce the bigger they get. They don't answer to us. They answer to someone at a state agency and primarily to their investors. Talk all you want about contracting out, but until it's someone you know you simply cannot imagine what it's like to suffer this fate. |
Imagine if you were diagnosed with cancer or diabetes and your care was through a government contractor corporation and you had no other choice of services. They prescribed the treatment, then cut you loose when done, except you weren't done. You still were ill and needed to be monitored or have someone give you your medication or… and there was no one to follow through until the next crisis. Meanwhile the state is debating about whether or not they should have to pay for something and the County continues to dismantle whatever services they used to provide. You're homeless and sicker by then and you become weak, dehydrated, and pass out. The cycle begins again. But this time you've lost hope and are so confused, discouraged and disempowered. Your family and friends are drained and feeling helpless. Dying is a real possibility.
On a concrete level, I suggest you take a look at the Pierce Co. website and try to find information about the values, mission, and services for the elderly, disabled, and those less fortunate. Look hard. Then look at King Co.'s website. Hard to miss. We are the only county in WA without a MH tax. We are the only county without an RSN. The state has been downshifting mental health services for almost 15 years and Pierce County leads the way in handing over care of our most vulnerable to a corporation.
It's not just about serving the most seriously psychiatrically ill. They are a very small percentage of those suffering, but they are catching a lot of attention because of the damage they are wreaking on our quality of life, namely our sense of safety. Those with addictions issues are also not being adequately served and they are having a different and serious impact on our quality of life. These 2 groups are a very small percentage of the population needing services, less than 1%. The bigger problem down the line is reaching out to the kids and families. Very few services are widely available and what's available keeps getting cut back more and more. We have HUGE problems with among our kids. HUGE! They need help NOW.
If you want to learn more contact your local city, county and state representatives. Jeanne Darneille represents the 27th district in Olympia. Tim Farrell represents Tacoma on the Pierce Co. Council and is te only one on that Council who has any interest in social service or social policy. He could use our interest and support. Ryan Mello is the go to person on the Tacoma City Council. Stay tuned for Puyallup and Lakewood City Councils' votes on this very important issue. Enough said!
by fredo on 6/7/2012 @ 6:33am
Amsierra, mental health issues aren't the only issue in Pierce County. There are also the issues of the recession and high tax burdens for many people. Perhaps we could reduce salaries for government workers and use that money to fund mental health services. The taxpayers, I'm sorry to say, are pretty much tapped out.
by cisserosmiley on 6/7/2012 @ 6:52am
|Taxpayers are tapped out for bs, but paying for MH issues is well supported in our community. Why rail against it Fredo when a majority of folks in Tacoma want it?|
by fredo on 6/7/2012 @ 7:43am
The majority want it?
by NineInchNachos on 6/7/2012 @ 8:11am
|thanks amsierra !|
by fredo on 6/7/2012 @ 8:41am
Actually cissero, I didn't indicate that mental health funding was a bad thing. I said additional taxes were a bad thing. I suggested that we fund MH services by reducing salaries for government employees. Why would my suggestion be less beneficial to folks who need MH services than the current arrangement? I don't get it. If you get some help with a MH issue do you really care where the money came from?
by amsierra on 6/7/2012 @ 10:02am
|MH services are the most underfunded health service. Inadequate funding directly affects access and increases stigmatization, which we've been reducing for years. Lack of services affects those with a MH diagnosis in myriad ways and their families and communities. For example, the ability to care for oneself is impacted and other services are needed, such as social services, law enforcement, fire/EMT.
Reducing salaries might make a dent, but don't start with the social workers because they work too hard for their money now. The County Councilmembers make way too much, I believe, plus they have have other perks, such as a very generous car allowance on top of their 6-figure salary.
In the end what you need to do is study the problem, ask questions--lots+endless-and go to some meetings of the Pierce Co. Council, if you can.
by NineInchNachos on 6/7/2012 @ 10:21am
|Pierce County spokesperson says not so fast! |
"Cute, but you've got it wrong. Pierce County fought to keep the system, but the state decided to try the private model."
by fredo on 6/7/2012 @ 10:26am
|There are two issues under consideration:|
Should we fund mental health services?
AND (if the answer is yes)
Should we provide this funding from existing sources or new sources of revenue?
Of course it's hard to fund from existing sources because you're going to step on some public employee's toes. On the other hand, increasing taxes is stepping on taxpayers toes. The fact is, not every "taxpayer" can afford an increased tax burden and some of these people will become depressed and need treatment. This will make the mental health of our citizenry WORSE, not BETTER.
by cisserosmiley on 6/7/2012 @ 10:29am
|Fredo, it's a statistical fact that voters in Tacoma will support a NEW tax on MH care at a 2:1 ratio. Give the majority what they want, higher taxes!|
by fredo on 6/7/2012 @ 10:31am
| "MH services are the most underfunded health service."|
Maybe if we reduced government salaries we could provide more funding.
by fredo on 6/7/2012 @ 10:43am
| "Fredo, it's a statistical fact that voters in Tacoma will support a NEW tax on MH " cissero|
What is the source of your information?
by cisserosmiley on 6/7/2012 @ 11:39am
|The average margin of victory of the "districted" council members is 2:1. Each represents approx. 40k citizens. A sample of 5k-12k voted in each race and that is WAY bigger of a sample than needed for a solid confidence interval. |
All council members voted for it. WE have a representative council. That means all 200,000 citizens' representative votes were for a MH tax. I'll give you 1/3 of voters voting for "other candidates" may disagree that their council member reps them personally. That's how I derive a 2:1 support statistic for new MH tax.
by fredo on 6/7/2012 @ 1:13pm
|The same council members voted unanimously for the Clear Channel Billboard settlement that would have placed digital billboards all over town. |
So does that mean that 200,000 people favored digital billboards?
by The Jinxmedic on 6/7/2012 @ 1:38pm
+1 to Fredo!
by cisserosmiley on 6/7/2012 @ 1:50pm
|No it does not. It's a very valid point I chose not to address because of length...but here it is. The 2:1 margin I used also is approx. the level of support an issue needs to be pulled back from gov. both formally as in veto overrule and informally WE as a voter population trend towards being ok with stuff when more than 2/3 support it.
If opponents of this tax increase had any numbers close to 2/3 opposition, as the billboard issue did, WE would have seen it & would have used that qualitative observation as an error term that worked against the validity of the 2:1 election margin statistic I started with.
by fredo on 6/7/2012 @ 2:02pm
by cisserosmiley on 6/7/2012 @ 2:17pm
|To simplify for Fredo, if I was wrong there would be a parade of diverse citizens demonstrating city hall over MH taxes...but there's not.|
by fredo on 6/7/2012 @ 2:30pm
| " All council members voted for it. WE have a representative council. That means all 200,000 citizens' representative votes were for a MH tax" cissero|
Try substituting the the term "clear channel settlement" for "MH tax."
by cisserosmiley on 6/7/2012 @ 2:47pm
|I did. Then I subjected the clearchannel statement to the validity test of:
Did a parade of diverse citizens demonstrate at city hall until it was reversed? YES
Now subject MH tax to the same statement: NO, nobody but Fredo bitched...thanks for checking my work, but it is thorough.
by NineInchNachos on 6/7/2012 @ 2:51pm
|now just replace "clear channel settlement" with pooping nazis. really makes you think.|
by fredo on 6/7/2012 @ 3:16pm
| Here's your validity test simplified:|
If the council votes unanimously for something I agree with then they are speaking on behalf of all of the citizens in Tacoma.
If the council votes unanimously for something I disagree with then I'll come up with some bullshit "validity" test that will indicate that they actually WEREN'T speaking on behalf of the citizens.
Cissero you're too funny.
by cisserosmiley on 6/7/2012 @ 3:21pm
|It's called representative democracy. Without larger councils we are left with a simple statistical measurement as you stated:
If a law passed and stays passed WE wanted it...by exactly the vote of each council persons' most recent election.
by fredo on 6/7/2012 @ 3:28pm
Incidentally, the Clear Channel settlement agreement hasn't been "reversed" as you claim. Clear Channel signed the agreement and is refusing to allow the city to back out of the agreement. That agreement "is passed and stays passed like WE wanted it...exactly the vote of each council person's most recent election.
by cisserosmiley on 6/7/2012 @ 3:30pm
|Then where are all the digital billboards? The statistical fact is 0 digital billboards are maintained by CC in Tacoma.|
by fredo on 6/7/2012 @ 3:38pm
|It's in the court's hands cissero, but since the council voted for it unanimously I guess we're getting "what we wanted". |
Also, since we signed the agreement and then tried to back out of it, clear channel won't even remove the non-conformings. And the city manager declared a moritorium on enforcement. So we're basically double screwed now.
by The Jinxmedic on 6/7/2012 @ 3:50pm
|Enough signatures have been collected for Referendum 74 that I suppose that everybody is against gay marriage, i.e. "representative democracy"...|
by cisserosmiley on 6/7/2012 @ 3:52pm
|But MH services will be funded to parity with many surrounding areas now:) I concede every point Fredo ever made about taxation, small gov, irresponsible expenditures, but MH care is a measurement of our own humanity and needs to be supported. A sales tax is how WE do it, please concede this is good Fredo!|
by cisserosmiley on 6/7/2012 @ 3:55pm
|Re: gay marriage
That's so loose what can I say? Signatures of registered voters aren't council members? How are they synonymous? On the day the Tacoma city council votes 9-0 against marriage equalization I can respond.
by CaptainBritton on 6/7/2012 @ 4:05pm
|This comic is crazy-true it turns out...Here is a FB update. |
"Jeannie DarneilleYesterday near TacomaCrazy
start to the day. I interrupted a home burglary at my next door
neighbor's house, chased two guys to the alley as they jumped on
motorcycles, caught one of the plates, called TPD, and they've got one
suspect in custody. Everyone should have a jolt of adrenaline as they
stand in the kitchen eating their oatmeal!"
She is a Super-heroine! Wowie!
by NineInchNachos on 6/7/2012 @ 4:05pm
|I hear you Cissero|
by NineInchNachos on 6/7/2012 @ 4:09pm
|@britton. HOLY CATS!|
by NineInchNachos on 6/7/2012 @ 4:49pm
|I hereby present Jeannie Darneille with the Phoenix Jones Honorary Jr. Patrol Merit Badge|
by NineInchNachos on 6/7/2012 @ 7:52pm
by fredo on 6/7/2012 @ 8:19pm
@6:33 this morning I mentioned that it would be OK to fund MH services by methods other than tax increases. Apparently I'm not opposed to funding MH services. I'll concede they are important. Will I concede that there is no way except a sales tax to fund the services. No, why should I?
by cisserosmiley on 6/7/2012 @ 11:59pm
|Because sales tax is the most efficient way WE fund gov. Firing people reduces our economy. Sales tax revenue can start now but property tax would take a year to start. Firing people might take months to realize extra money. Sales tax is collected by "volunteer" tax collectors (thanks business owners) property tax needs the county gov. to collect money then give it to the city. It's solid, even if a bunch of liberals thought it up, it's fast, efficient and cheap to implement.|
by fredo on 6/8/2012 @ 6:57am
I never suggested "firing people."
by NineInchNachos on 9/11/2012 @ 11:46am
|go pierce county! |
by cisserosmiley on 9/11/2012 @ 12:32pm
|In more sun shiny news...the wife was at the pierce county facility on the golf course yesterday and she reports all are excited at the new restaraunt and hotel space that is being built to accommodate Tiger Woods groupies.|
by JesseHillFan on 9/11/2012 @ 5:30pm
|On another note our think different differently sane the traveller has been back in Pierce County Jail and he is scheduled for release on April 15,2013 at 8:00 AM.That's only 7 months away!So while the Tacoma City Council has been given a reprieve for a while TV Tacoma will get some comedy and become an entertainment channel again by next year|
by NineInchNachos on 9/11/2012 @ 7:57pm
|will be interesting to compare his sanity level going in to when he gets out.
by JesseHillFan on 9/12/2012 @ 8:31am
|Incarceration will likely make probably him more hostile and bitter.Not good for anyone's mental health much less those whom have problems to begin with.|
by NineInchNachos on 9/12/2012 @ 8:39am
|Perhaps Pierce County will blame the state for Mr. Hill 2013 as well.
by cisserosmiley on 9/12/2012 @ 8:42am
|Bus him to king county for proper MH treatment|
by NineInchNachos on 12/10/2012 @ 8:22am
|thanks for nothing Pierce County! |
by NineInchNachos on 3/11/2013 @ 8:25am
by NineInchNachos on 3/20/2013 @ 1:27pm
by NineInchNachos on 3/31/2013 @ 8:10pm
|pierce county council should be fired www.thenewstribune.com//2013/03/31/25372...